Is It Immodest to Wear Deliberately Ripped Clothes?

Is It Immodest to Wear Deliberately Ripped Clothes?

“Deliberately ripped garments work against the purpose of clothes.”

Perhaps one of the more sensitive personal issues you can raise with people is that of dress. How you dress has become a purely personal affair. Most are left to their own opinion as to what is appropriate.

There are, of course, some limits. Most Catholics will admit in theory that there is something that might be labeled “immoral or immodest dress.” These are clothes (or the lack thereof) that cover the body insufficiently and therefore are not morally or socially acceptable.

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However, outside this extreme, most people seem to think they can wear anything, anywhere and at any time without any consequences. Clothes don’t have to be clean anymore. People can wear clothes that are deliberately ripped, stained and full of holes without fear of rejection. Clothes don’t even have to be clothes anymore. They can be shredded rags, the dingier the better.

Making Clothes Look Distressed
Such tattered garments are called “distressed” clothes (rightfully so), and they are becoming increasingly fashionable. It’s not just amateurs haphazardly ripping up faded jeans or retailers making random tears anymore. It is going mainstream.

The world of high fashion has now embraced “distressed” clothing as chic. Fashion designers are using new technology and hiring special effects technicians to get that natural moth-eaten, threadbare look that makes it seem like you’ve been wearing the garment for twenty years. Specialists are using blow torches, air guns, lasers and sanding machines to deliver loose threads, faded fabric and gaping holes. Nordstrom has just retailed a $425 pair of jeans with a caked-mud look.

Wearing ripped clothes has become a fashion statement that supposedly says a person is carefree, uninhibited and self-sufficient. Ironically, such “independent” people are flocking to the fashion in a rush to look just like everyone else. Moreover, those who buy ripped-up clothing are likely getting ripped off. The tattered name-brand clothes often outsell new unripped ones and come with a much heftier price tag.

Beyond the Obvious
The world is mad. Can’t anyone say it?

You should not have to explain why you don’t wear ripped clothes. This is something your mother should have taught you at an early age. She would sew up your tears the minute she saw them. If she found a hole in a purchase, she would make you take back such clothes to the store for a refund.

Times have sadly changed, and so have some mothers. A lot of fashion conscious moms can now be found in shredded shorts and custom-holed t-shirts.

Maybe a review of the basics will help make it clear why it is wrong. As politically incorrect as it might sound, it needs to be said that ripped garments are not modest clothing and should not be worn.

Not Clothing
Perhaps the first place to start is by affirming that a ripped garment is not modest clothing because it is not real clothing. This claim is guaranteed to raise a firestorm, but from a purely metaphysical perspective, it must be admitted that such garments fail to fulfill their purpose.

Most people would object that it is still clothing, but just a different kind that is more comfortable and thus makes people happier. People should do that which makes them happiest. Therefore they should wear ripped clothes so as not to worry about their appearance or condition. It is all about comfort.

While clothing should be comfortable, the purpose of clothing is not comfort but protection. Clothing exists to protect and adorn the body and modesty of the person. To claim that comfort is the purpose of clothing is like saying tastiness, not nutrition, is the purpose of food. It is like saying relaxation, not rejuvenation, is the purpose of sleep.

Working Against Clothing’s Purpose
Thus, when a fashion designer carefully crafts a garment with a hole in a place where it would naturally appear through wear, he is making clothes that deliberately expose to risk the places which need the most protection. When that same designer put holes in sexually suggestive places, he is once again working against clothing’s purpose of shielding modesty.

Deliberately ripped garments work against the purpose of clothes. They are caricatures of what clothing should be. Far from adorning the body, the process of ripping turns that which should be strong, beautiful and orderly into something weak, ugly and frayed. Tattered attire is disordered and therefore should not be worn.

Lost Notion of Modesty
The second reason why ripped clothing should not be worn is that it is immodest.

Again such a claim raises hackles. Most people would object that as long as tattered clothes stay outside the extreme point of undress that is considered morally and socially unacceptable, you cannot say that it is immodest.

And here is the crux of the problem. People have completely lost the notion of what modesty is and how it is manifested. People lack even a catechism definition of this virtue.

People confuse modesty with chastity and thus only associate it with sensuality. Modesty does play a major role in preserving chastity, but it is much more than that. It is often mistakenly associated only with female attire, but it also applies to men.

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The Dignity of the Individual
Modesty is the virtue that safeguards the dignity of a person in association with others. It benefits both the individual and society because it governs the exterior appearance and behavior of the person and thus helps make society civil and harmonious.

Beyond dress, modesty is concerned with the manner of speech, posture, gestures, and general presentation of the person. Modesty calls upon people to behave well with others and conform to standards of decency and decorum found in the healthy customs of an ordered society.

When you present yourself properly to others, you are modest. When you control yourself in your external actions and manners in society, you are modest. When you act erratically and speak in a manner that offends and disregards others, you are immodest.

Negligence in Attire
In matters of Catholic dress, this means holding to all that is proper to a soul that is a temple of the Holy Spirit. That is to say, you dress in a manner that is ordered, dignified and reasonable to who you are. Adults dress like adults; children dress like children. Authorities dress in accord with their office.

It also means you should not dress carelessly. Saint Thomas Aquinas states that you are immodest when you are unduly negligent in your appearance and fail to present yourself according to your state in life. You are also immodest when you seek to attract attention to yourself by showing a lack of concern for presenting oneself well (Summa, II-II, q. 169, a. 1).

Immoral and revealing clothing is of course immodest. However, improper, soiled and ripped unisex clothing is also immodest. It is not proper to the dignity of a person made in the image and likeness of God. When Our Lady spoke out against immodest fashions at Fatima, she was referring to this kind of immodesty as well.

Fighting Immodesty
Modesty used to be determined by established notions of decorum and decency that varied from culture to culture. The problem today is that there are few standards of decency left. Indeed, indecency has become the standard.

In an everything-goes society consumed with the frenetic intemperance of modern life, you are told you must have everything now, instantly and effortlessly, regardless of the consequences. You are encouraged to act immodestly in manners, speech and dress. Is it any wonder society is so uncivil these days? Is it surprising that there is so much talk of the lack of human dignity?

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Given the lack of standards, it is hard to know where to begin the return to order. One way to start is by unmasking the myth of mass markets that pressure you to act immodestly. The acceptance of “distressed” clothes everywhere is not an expression of individuality but submission. By accepting them, you become a slave of fashion, not an independent thinker.

If you want to stand out as an individual today, dress properly and modestly. If you are not sure what constitutes modesty in these times, at least avoid all that is not. A very good start is to resist the distressing tattered attire fad.

  • Marilyn AnnBartko

    Thank you for this article. “Distressed” clothes literally are a “rip off” and indecent.

    • SMG

      It’s nothing but lack of respect for yourselfs!! When you do not care how stupid you look.!

  • Frank Mountbatton

    Agreed!

  • Ginnyfree

    About those $425 Nordstrom jeans. I just checked with my neighbor and he said anyone interested in expensive mud caked jeans can contact him and he’ll sell you his for $350. He reassures all interested persons that the mud is authentically work-related and there is no extra charge for the rip near the back pocket. It was done by a real nail on a real board he sat across eating his real lunch and his buddy, Bubba can vouch for the facts surrounding the incident that caused the authentic rusty nail produced rip in the derriere region of said mud caked jeans. He also wants to let those interested know that henceforth, if there remains a market for said mud caked jeans he will guarantee another 51 pairs of ’em, but he can only ship one pair a week as he needs them for work and lovingly wears them a full 5 days before shipment. Bubba says there’s no charge for the smell and if UPS doesn’t mind it, neither will you. How sweet. God bless. Ginnyfree.

    • married Mari

      LOL !!! I almost sprayed a drink out of mouth onto my jeans !!!
      Your friend should have an extra charges on jeans for his great advertisement
      or teaching skills, that make clients think twice for it’s value of “hard to get”s.

      • Janet

        I hope you didn’t wear Jeans for church, married Mari! )

    • ElyseTheMom

      Brilliant! Thanks for sharing! I’m going to share this with my friends (none of whom where ripped clothing).

      • Ginnyfree

        Wrote right after Mass and Communion. I think the Holy Spirit inspired the wittier side of me. Glad you enjoyed it. God bless. Ginnyfree.

    • Devasahayam the Deplored

      Nice plan — instead of fake ageing/ripping, deliver the actual for lesser price….

    • Monique Guirguis

      hahahhaaa too funny 🙂

      • Ginnyfree

        Glad I could make you laugh Monique. God bless. Ginnyfree.

    • Oh! Yes! I have some authentic ripped workpants for women, too! Also dresses with guaranteed authentic missing buttons, bleach spots, and “keyholed” pockets! I must cash in on this trend! I authentically need the money and I’ve produced some wonderfully worn, good quality, comfortable cotton clothing over the years. For $500, I’ll ship a dress worn (and noticed) on an historic occasion! (And the ripped hem is quite modest, a few inches below the knee.)

      LOL

  • Elizabeth

    I definitely agree with you. The problem with immodest dressing should be addressed from the pulpit. I have heard people say “oh at least they are in church”, or “they can’t afford good clothes”! I respond that people: go out to eat, people smoke, people go on vacations, etc….. There are many consignment stores where one can find good clothes for $2, $3 or $4 – anyone can afford! Modesty is not something people care about anymore-it is all about self! God help us!!!

    • Going to Mass and living a good life is far more important than “looking the part.”

      • robert

        It’s not “eitheror”…it’s “both/and.”

  • florida1

    I was just thinking on fashion the other day; I too can not understand why folks pay money for ripped and dingy looking clothing. I ALSO noted that More and MORE models, movie stars, singers, etc women are NOW wearing SHEER blouses with NO Bras (I can NOT fathom their walking like that!!) and their Nipples are clearly exposed. I am embarrassed and ashamed for them! Also their is a growing trend for the Backs of gowns and dresses to be CUT down to and Showing the ‘crack’ of the butt. Ready for this one? New one is the “”V”’ slit…YEP you read right. It is a slit where of course they wear NO panties and when they walk or move—THEIR Vaginas show to all who would like to see. JESUS CHRIST IS COMING BACK..soon folks…I TELL YOU it will be in the Generation of Boomers. 1946-1964 the youngest boomers are about 53 or so…it WILL be in the BOOMER’s generation life. THERE WILL BE BOOMERS LEFT TO SEE THE SECOND COMING OF OUR LORD…this is an immoral generation. Jesus Christ did NOT die so that so called ‘Christians and Catholics’ can dress like above or wear almost nothing to Mass! We must strive to be holy….God bless all who read this and help pray for today’s Lost World….

    • jeddrich

      Hope you are right but such predictions about dates of the End Times are usually proved wrong.

    • Flame

      Florida, I don’t watch “awards” shows or similar kinds of “red carpet” events, but one can’t watch news the following day without the anchors doing a recap of what everyone wore. I look at some of those outfits and think the wearers should be arrested for indecent exposure. Don’t such laws still remain on the books? I used to watch a certain TV serial that involved “fashion,” and when I saw a mini-dress covered with long sheer veiling offered as a wedding gown, I almost threw up.

      No wonder the younger generation doesn’t know better when this is what they have displayed before them as “entertainment.”

  • While I find it appalling that companies are selling “pre-dirtied” clothing (something I get for free from a hard day’s work) at exorbitant prices, to say that rips in your jeans is immodest is preposterous. So long as the rips are not in your crotch area, your modesty is intact and any “preacher” who claims your eternal soul is in mortal danger from a rip in the knee of your pants is nothing more than a charlatan.

    In Matthew 15, the Pharisees are having a fit because Jesus is eating with unwashed hands – something the religious leader of that time deemed “immoral”. To them Jesus answered “11 Not that which goeth into the mouth defileth a man; but that which cometh out of the mouth, this defileth a man.” (As with all Bible quotes, I urge you to read the full passage yourself for context.) The same principle applies here.

    Further more, read Luke 16:19-31 – the parable of the rich man and Lazarus. In part – ““There was a certain rich man who was splendidly clothed in purple and fine linen and who lived each day in luxury. 20 At his gate lay a poor man named Lazarus who was covered with sores. 22 Finally, the poor man died and was carried by the angels to sit beside Abraham at the heavenly banquet. The rich man also died and was buried, 23 and he went to the place of the dead.” God does not care what you wear, so long as your heart is pure. Do not let these men who claim to speak for God to mislead you.

    • monkbiker

      Sounds like you didn’t bother to read the article. Or perhaps you did and missed the salient points. Perhaps you read into it what you wanted to read into it. Maybe you could read it again, but this time try reading it with an open mind.

      • Oh, I did read the article…

        | That is to say, you dress in a manner that is ordered, dignified and
        reasonable to who you are. Adults dress like adults; children dress like children. Authorities dress in accord with their office.

        | Perhaps the first place to start is by affirming that a ripped garment is not modest clothing because it is not real clothing… Far from adorning the body, the process of ripping turns that which
        should be strong, beautiful and orderly into something weak, ugly and
        frayed. Tattered attire is disordered and therefore should not be worn.

        | However, improper, soiled and ripped unisex clothing is also immodest…. The second reason why ripped clothing should not be worn is that it is immodest. [back to my “crotch” argument.]

        I could go on and on. If I missed the salient points, please point them out to me. My mind is always open, but never to the point that my brain is at risk of falling out 🙂

        • Lisa Mladinich

          It’s even more “distressing” to see such a lack of civility and basic Christian charity displayed by a fellow Catholic, Derek. Saying a prayer for wisdom and peace for all of us. Come, Holy Spirit!

          • Exactly how am I being “uncivil” “uncharitable?” I am making counter arguments to posts that I find erroneous. Or does being a good little Catholic mean that I cannot question authority, or in this case, general human human assumptions. I have been nothing but civil. You should see me when I’m not 🙂

          • Deborah Sullivan

            Derek,
            You said something in one of your other posts about making people comfortable is more important than how you look. The thing is, you can make people uncomfortable if you habitually wear ripped clothing around them (or too short shorts or inappropriate bathing suits, which are most of them nowadays).
            If a person is so poor he doesn’t have intact clothing, that’s one thing. But if you have the means to dress in intact clothes, then you should do so. If you don’t take the time to be neat and presentable, and go around in ripped clothes, and say to yourself “people around me shouldn’t care how I look,” you are putting your wants above the comfort of others. If you’re doing some manual labor, and you rip your jeans in the process and can’t change right away, that’s one thing. When you are dressing for the day, though, and you have one pair that is ripped that you like better than your unripped pair that looks better, I would hope that you choose the unripped pair.

          • But we are not talking about clothes that are truly immodest – “too short shorts or inappropriate bathing suits” – we are talking about ripped jeans, where the rips being discussed are generally in the knee and leg area. This is not “immodest” and I am sorry, but if people are “uncomfortable” because of someone else wearing something other than what they believe they should (such as a ripped knee), then that person is shallow, at the very least, or worse yet, “high and mighty” … I know that no one here is going to agree with me and that is fine. But all of you need to focus on the truly immoral acts going on in this modern day Sodom and Gomorrah – murder on the rise daily, abortions, trans-this and LGBT-that…. Instead, y’all focus on what someone chooses to wear. Again, I’m sorry, but that is petty – and God is not a petty God.

          • TesaBess333

            You missed the point of what real immodesty is—it is more than exposing skin, and clothing is for protection. Therefore, if one purchases pants with the knees already torn, they don’t fall into the category of modesty/protection.

          • In that case, I hope that no one here ever wears t-shirts or shorts or skirts or any type of open-toe shoe such as sandals because these types of immodest clothing do not provide the full protection afforded by jeans, long sleeve shirts and steel-toed work boots.

          • Margaret

            In 2004, I went on the Auriesville pilgrimage. I thought I was ok. The priest was hearing confessions while walking the pilgrimage. After hearing my confession, he told me as part of my penance: “Get rid of all your immodest clothing.” What kind of clothing? See-through blouses, shorts, skirts with back/front/side slits and much more. I can’t tell you all the clothes I got rid of. I probably got rid of a couple hundred dollars worth of clothes.

            Google “Immodesty: Satan’s Virtue”. It’s not in print, but you could find it on Amazon. Fantastic book. I highly recommend it.

          • I can understand see-through tops. That is immodest. A case can be made for slits “up to there” in skirts. But shorts? No. I looked at the booklet you mention. Everything in there – http://www.littleflowersfamilypress.com/15-quotes-modesty-immmodesty-satans-virtue/ – relates to true immodesty… see-through tops, mini skirts that hide nothing…. yes, there are whorish clothing abound in this generation. The only point that I would have a problem with is number 8 where a Prefect decided that dresses two fingers below the throat is “immodest.” Like I have said here to others, just because an imperfect, fallible man decides that to see your neck or to see a knee is to court damnation does not make it so.

            Having said that, if you are happy with your style of dress, then that is great. I would never tell anyone that they are wrong when all they are trying to do it right. God knows what is in the hearts of His children.

            I want to thank you for being one of the few here who actually replied with decency instead of fire and brimstone damnation of my soul for my transgression of challenging the edict of a mortal man.

          • Margaret

            Actually, that regulation makes sense. Try this:

            Take your right hand, make the Cub Scout/Brownie sign (index and middle fingers up; thumb over ring and pinky fingers).

            Keeping your hand this way, turn your hand 90 degrees so the index and middle fingers are horizontal.

            Keeping your hand this way, put it at the bottom of the pit of the throat (V).

            The top of a modest dress should come to the middle finger.

            Reason: God created each human being in His image. To destroy His image by sin (Immodesty, adultery, etc.) is another form of iconoclasm.

            More later.

          • Ginnyfree

            Derek, I’m not going to look it up for you but a Pope actually issued a document regrading how a woman should dress. Might have been Pius X, but I’m not certain. He even included a measurement regarding the length of sleeves for women – they need to be below the elbow and off the shoulder dresses forget it! Bottom line: the Church actually has a dress code. If you need the true model we got it from, I suggest you take a good look at the image of our Lady of Guadalupe and see how the Queen of Heaven is attired for representing her Divine Son, our Blessed Lord, Jesus Christ, to us. God bless. Ginnyfree.

          • TesaBess333

            A “good little Catholic” does not question Authority (God’s and Church teaching).

          • I don’t question God. I do question man.

    • married Mari

      That’s exactly what we believe, as the center of the modesty : PURE IN HEART.
      So those who INTENTIONALLY rip their clothes that covers the “TEMPLE OF THE
      HOLY SPIRIT” is rather questionable, if their interest is in keeping their body & hear
      pure fit as GOD’s children.

      • We? You know… as someone raised Catholic, never in my life has anyone ever tried to be so “above” me outside of the Church… any church, really. But I’ll leave that alone for the time being.

        Unless those intentional rips are exposing the, oh my gosh, “naughty” bits… no one is IMMODEST for exposing a knee or a leg, be it intentional or not, any more than wearing shorts or a bathing suit would be considered “immodest” and condemnable to Hell.

        Maybe I’m wrong. Maybe on Judgment Day, I will stand before God and He will condemn me to Hell because I wore ripped jeans, or because I have tattoos, or because I drink liquor and swear… but you know what? At least I will will go to Hell knowing that I did what I could to make life more pleasant for those around me. I will go to Damnation knowing that in my life, God was the reason I did what treated people the way I did; not always perfect, never caring about my “appearance” but rather the comfort and salvation of others. Then, I guess “we” will have the final laugh from on High….

        • MaryB435

          Dear Derek,
          You may be missing some of the points.
          I don’t understand some of your reasoning:
          “At least I will go to Hell knowing that I did what I could to make life more pleasant for those around me. I will go to Damnation knowing that in my life, God was the reason I…treated people the way I did.” Huh? There’s a contradiction here.
          .
          Following God’s will does not send people to Hell. God loves you and wants you to go to Heaven. We need to love God and follow His will. We also need to put effort into learning what Jesus wants us to do.

          • The contradiction is only because the others replying are insinuating that the way I believe and the way I live my life is the path to hell. I was making a point. “At least I will go to Hell [according to my accusers]…”

            You are correct regarding God’s Will. The problem is that people want to dictate God’s Will to Him.

        • Phil Alcoceli

          You see God as a nervous, self-doubting, guilt-ridden parent or grandparent who is massively and obssesively worried about being coinsidered the “good, soft and kind one” and that we should all follow that senile idea of who God is.

          Your false courage about willing to end is hell by being the self -appointed-soft-savior is pathetic and dangerous and part of today’s LFSI: Liberal Fascist Suicidal Infantilism. Only Chrsitian holiness is truly human, everything else is demonic and that is more obvious everyday but not for those in LFSI.

          • No. I see God as a vengeful (Sodom and Gomorrah; the Great Flood…) yet merciful God (His Son…).

        • TesaBess333

          You obviously miss the entire point of the article.

          • The only point that I took away from this article, and that has been blatantly explained to me by the saints who are replying to me, is that regardless of my devotion to God, I’m going to hell because I don’t dress hoity toity enough, what with riped jeans and grease stained t-shirts. If there is another point, I would be happy to hear it.

          • I’m wondering whether you just keep on wearing your own jeans that you’ve ripped instead of buying new ones, as a point of economy, or whether you’re paying extra for bogus “distressed” jeans, which…I’m not going to get all worked up about its being immodest, but I do think it’s ridiculous. The things New Yorkers will try to sell the people they exploit! The things those people will buy!

            If you’re wearing your own old clothes in order to do more good with the money, *that* I respect, and I imagine God does too.

            I also think some people on this page are talking about casual or labor-job clothes, and others are talking about what Catholics wear *to church*. (I have no opinion about Catholics. As a whole-Bible Protestant I was taught that going to church is optional, but if I do go I personally prefer to put on some sort of clean dress–nothing uncomfortable, certainly no pinchy-toed shoes, but something a bit “dressier” than I’d wear on a labor job. Just a vote.)

          • No… I do not buy pre-ripped jeans, nor do I rip my own (although my girlfriend does because she likes the look). I wear mine because to spend money for something so frivolous as a rip is to me, a waste of money that is better spent on other things. I must disagree, though, that those attacking me are only concerned with what you wear to church. In their minds, if your jeans are ripped and your knee is showing… may God have mercy on your damned soul. But like I said, if you are going to church, God doesn’t care what you wear, only that you’re there. But if you WANT to dress up, that’s fine too… 🙂

    • Ada onya

      Your main problem here Derek is that you don’t like to be preached at and that is infantil in extreme, because nobody know everything. Just give it a little thought & prayer and see what you think afterwards & of course don’t be ashamed to admit that you were wrong. Secondly: this is what is called the “fashion of the Ugly” because it it the absolute oposite of everything lovely, graceful, orderly inspired by the grace of God. it is the showcase for how our whole society is taken over completely by diabolic influence , the lack of will to combat it.

      • As I said before is that ripped jeans is not “the showcase for how our whole society is taken over completely by diabolic influence , the lack of will to combat it.” That is fully exposed by the true moral issues at work in this world – murder on the rise, abortions, trans-this and LGBT-that…. Ripped jeans may be “ugly” to you – I find a lot of fashion ugly and ridiculous – but societal fashions are not God’s main concern. If we were talking about girls walking around with their tatas hanging out or guys were walking around just swinging…. then we could talk about immoral immodesty. And no… I do not like to be preached AT. I am not a little kid. And as you said, “nobody knows everything”…. that goes for everyone here.

  • foxie

    I don’t believe this has anything to do with religion but it does have to do with self-respect. If that was all a person had and had no income to buy new clothing that would be one thing but as you said this has become a direction our designers have taken. It is like everything else ~ clothing, art, advertising, etc. have gone to the devil’s way of making the human race taking on the air of Satan. You are viewed with a different look by the public. To sit in a mall and watch people walk by is exasperating. Women look like men and men like women. A woman should dress like a woman but not like some sex siren either! I bet the Jewish people that God brought out of Egypt didn’t look like this nor did they 40 years later when they were crying for food.

  • married Mari

    LOL !!! I almost sprayed a drink out of mouth onto my jeans !!!
    Your friend should have an extra charges on jeans for his great advertisement
    or teaching skills, that make clients think twice for it’s value of “hard to gets”.

  • Gtrgrl1174

    Sadly, this is really a generational issue. I find some ripped clothing to be ridiculous but some of it is cute. It’s possible to be tasteful and in style. There is nothing wrong with keeping up with trends, modestly, as long as your reason for doing so is not self esteem related. As the mother of a tween daughter, I think how I dress is an important example to my daughter. It’s a valuable lesson for me to show her that I can be in style and maintain self respect. There are far more offensive trends than ripped clothing. The larger issue is the over sexualized images young girls see. We need to teach our girls to be God fearing and modest, but, they don’t have to dress Amish to do so.

    • Regina

      Agreed! Good mama!

    • robert

      You’ve already made the step towards compromise.

  • married Mari

    I’m sorry, the comment I made below with “LOL !!!” was for : what Ginniyfree wrote !

  • Martha

    I could never understand why people would buy ruined/ripped clothing – to me it belongs in the garbage. I also hate the fashion of low-cut and extremely short dresses. These women look like prostitutes! Men, also prefer modesty in women. Who would want to marry someone he couldn’t respect? And why don’t women want to be respected? The world is truly sick! We need to pray and do penance.

    • robert

      And why don’t women want to be respected?

      Because…men (mankind) love darkness, rather than light. They are born enemies of God, and the only thing that can help them is the graces of God as found in the Sacraments of the Catholic Church….without these graces, people only descend into greater darkness….they love it.

  • capsilog

    On the other hand, a lot of people especially women have been wearing skimpy shorts or really mini skirts have been going to Mass. Some are even wearing blouses showing more skin than usual and they are “fashionable”? Men come in t-shirts with inappropriate slogans and some in shorts.

    That’s why we call proper Church attire as our Sunday best. Ripped jeans fall into the same category of immodesty. Blouses for women revealing bare backs and shoulders, plunging necklines, skimpy shorts and skirts which they often tug down to their knees (why wear it in the first place if you constantly pull that inadequate covering down?) are even lining up to Communion, an even bigger disrespect to our Lord.

    • Janet

      I observed two women in church with very short shorts on receiving Holy Communion. I didn’t want to look at them, but they were in my face, so to speak. That then causes me distraction as I’m trying to contemplate after receiving Our Lord. I vowed, if the Holy Spirit had me run in to them after Mass I would say something to them. I didn’t see them again. Our Lady of Fatima says Our Lord is VERY offended with these immodest fashions.

      • capsilog

        Our dear Blessed Mother is our model of modesty and purity. She has shown always in her numerous apparitions how women should appear, modest, chaste and pure, that even men would emulate as well. I believe that modesty should not be sacrificed in our mode of dressing or clothing but we should make our little sacrifices as well not to please others but to please Her and God. Though in a small way, hopefully it would be a worthy reparation for the transgression of others.

    • Rose Charles

      We must give God our best

  • Màire Ní Bhroin

    We always used those iron on patches for our torn jeans (not really seen these days). I would agree that these clothes are a huge rip-off & can be immodest when made into very short-shorts or have gaping holes too high up on the leg or on the backside. But, when compared to wearing short-shorts, a pair of very torn jeans can give one much needed ventilation during heat waves & are much more modest, as they do cover the entire leg & protect from sun burn. Also, since I do know of no one who spends the huge amounts on the jeans that this article mentions perhaps, this fashion which came from the poor, helps the poor, who actually have torn, stained & “dirty looking” jeans, not feel like outcasts or unacceptable in society. Another thought, is that these jeans actually make class devisions neutralized & help the poor blend into a part of mainstream society. That is why I never judge people wearing these jeans because the people I see wearing them are usually from a lower income level & their jeans are inexpensive, naturally torn & neither a fashion statement nor deliberately worn to be immodest or disrespectful to others. As for the rich trying to emulate them for whatever reason, I cannot judge them either. As the Lord says -“Judge not lest ye be judged”! Thx for this timely article as it is a good reminder to help clothe the poor with decent clothing!

  • Dr. G

    When one dresses over-the-top pretentious, it is seen as a gouache way of showing off. Hypocrites did this to show off their wealth, “proving” how much better they were than the great unwashed masses. The only thing worse would be to wear $400+ ripped up jeans with fake mud on them – an extremely pretentious thing, indeed.

    • Flame

      You know, there’s another thing we have to look at also. A very large number of those people out there buying ripped and muddied clothing to be “in fashion” do not go to church at all. How sad that they trade their immortal souls for a bit of modern fad.

      • Dr. G

        Indeed. The Bible is rife with examples that such individuals experience their reward here on Earth. Trying to keep in fashion is one thing (the width of a tie, etcetera). This excess is telling.

  • Paul Mitchell

    Excellent article, John; some good food for thought. ‘

    Many of us have been
    stripped of true dignity, replacing dignity with a superficial egocentricity
    that is more concerned with image rather than personal integrity or ethics’ – quote from “A Psychology of Hypocrisy” Paul Mitchell,copyright 2006

    • Paul Mitchell

      …and all of this is happening according to a timetable…

  • Jarhead

    Don’t they want to look POOR so they are not robbed? OR are they just stupid??

  • Rosech Levy

    To me they are insulting those who can’t afford to destroy their clothes and that says I have money so I can do and call it the “latest fashion”. Not immoral but pretty darn stupid and shows lack of culture and taste and self-respect as far as I can see and tell. Immodesty, no, but again just flaunting because you pay big bucks in department stores for damaged goods.

  • Regina cates

    I am a devout Catholic, mom of 9 kids, oftentimes daily mass goer, and I wear ripped jeans sometimes, because they’re cute and in style.
    Worrying about and dissecting these types of subjects is so un-evangelistic and drives people away from the Church.

    You’ve missed the boat by at least 50-100 years, and I’m sad that we have thinkers in the church who write on the modesty or immodestly of ripped jeans, instead of helping our young people see truth amidst the mire and chaos they’re surrounded by in pop culture.

    • Minh

      Regina cates – You are so wrong in your comment that I pray that God leads you to see the truth. Damaged clothes are not cute and they are not fashion even if misguided people think they are. Conformity to high standards of dress and modesty is Godly and holy. What would you think of your priest if he wore torn and tattered vestments? That would be extremely disrespectful to God and the faithful. Adhering to the HIGHEST standards of modesty, conduct and dress is the responsibility of ALL Christians. As a mother of 9 children I encourage you to do better with regard to the bad example of modesty and dress that you are setting for them.

      • Regina cates

        I happen to enjoy fashion. I guarantee you don’t. (-:
        The King of Kings and Lord of the World isn’t concerned over my wearing jeans with rips in the knees. The Pharisees were, and in the modern day they still are.

      • Regina cates

        p.s. Just as I wouldn’t wear ripped jeans or a ripped dress to mass, so a priest wouldn’t wear tattered vestments. But if a priest wants to go to dinner with friends on an evening off, and wear jeans with rips in the knees, God our Father and Jesus, His Son, and the Holy Spirit, and Our Lady, wouldn’t bat an eye over rips in the knees of his jeans.

      • | What would you think of your priest if he wore torn and tattered
        vestments? That would be extremely disrespectful to God and the
        faithful.

        No. It wouldn’t. It would show that the priest’s main concern was spreading the Word of God, not his own appearance. I never once read in the Bible where Jesus said that His Word had to be preached from grandly decorated pulpits by majestically adorned priests. For all we know, Jesus Himself wore tattered robes, and as a poor man, I can see that easier than I can that He didn’t.

        THIS is the reason I no longer attend mass. The hypocrisy of the Catholic Church specifically and Christianity in general is appalling! Whether than worry about whether someone is wearing ripped jeans, maybe worry a little bit more about her moral character.

        I hope that when God returns to this failed planet, He shows His Church mercy for going so far astray from His Word and for leading so many souls down such a lost path…

        • Rose Charles

          This is no reason to leave the church you have to stay there and help remember the wheat and the thorn have to grow together .there is hypocrisy all about no one is perfect

        • Ginnyfree

          Let me get this right, the reason you don’t go to God’s house to worship Him in the way in which he prescribed for mankind is because 2,000 years of building for the Kingdom of God is too adorned for your discerning tastes? Your too holy to be bothered with us mere Catholics is the epitome of hypocrisy if I may say so. May remind you of that Word which you claim we’ve ignored to go our own way? In it, God states this about his Church: “I say to you, you are Peter and upon this rock I will build my Church and the gates of the nether world shall not prevail against it.” Now, if God himself said that all Hades wouldn’t stop him from building a Church, then how is what you claim actually happened true? I’ll answer that for you, so you don’t have to embarrass yourself with more bad ideas. Answer: you call God a liar and a failure. That two big fat sins against God. Shame on you. Go to Confession and return to God cleansed of your hypocrisy. He waits. God bless. Ginnyfree.

          • You show me in the Bible where it says that to enter in to the Kingdom of Heaven, one must first attend mass every Sunday. I’ll save you from having to embarrass yourself – it doesn’t. Yes, Jesus said “Upon this rock, I will build my Church.” Since we can all agree that Peter was not a literal rock, then it must further stand to reason that the Church about which Jesus spoke was not a physical church. The Church about which Jesus taught was the Word. And that Word is within all of us. That Word is in all of God’s Creation. That Word can be heard by anyone who chooses to listen, not just those who go to Church every Sunday and then return to their sinful lives on Monday. And I promise you I have seen enough of the heathen hypocrisy permeating throughout congregation after congregation.

            I never claimed to be holy. All of those here passing judgment on other are doing a good job of that themselves.

            Dress up in your Sunday finest, look down on those who do not fit into your perfect Christian mold, condemn those who DARE to question the Holy Catholic Church – a church of FALLIBLE men which was prophesied to fall by the children of Fatima before the End Times, as given to them by the Holy Mother of God, by the way – and I will continue to honor God in my way. May He have mercy on ALL of us.

          • Ginnyfree

            Derek: “Since we can all agree that Peter was not a literal rock, then it must further stand to reason that the Church about which Jesus spoke was not a physical church.”
            This is a Strawman argument meant to draw attention away from the facts. God said Peter is the rock foundation of his Church and all the Apostles witnessed his declaration of this fact. They acted upon it and deferred to Peter as the new Moses foretold in Scripture in prophecy. The entire Church understood his primal place and relied upon it. They also knew that there is only one Church and that God it is who builds. It is one, holy, catholic and apostolic as well as visible and unchanged in belief. These last two points, though not professed are equally relevant from an apologetic stand point. You will never convince a Catholic who is faithful that God did not mean a visible Church nor that he didn’t mean St. Peter as the rock foundation, the vicar of Christ and our visible head of our Church. The only persons who will agree with your Strawman are those like you who prefer sleeping in on Sundays and worshipping their sports heroes on the television to actual Mass attendance. There is more can I shoot back at you regarding your apologetic positions, but I lack time. You’ve got a bunch of lame excuses for not obeying your Bible’s mandates. I’ve heard them all. I’ll pray you get over yours soon. God bless. Ginnyfree

          • I agree with you on one point. The Catholic Church is the one true Church, established by Jesus in that one sentence you quoted. But that does not answer my question. Where in the Bible does where it says that to enter in to the Kingdom of Heaven, one must first attend mass every Sunday?

            And by the way, you do not know me. I sleep in every day – I work for myself so I can do that – and I do not even watch sports, so neither “excuse” has any bearing on my choices. But I am glad that someone of your apparent self-appointed standing in God’s Grace can tell me, a perfect stranger that you don’t even know, just why I’m going to Hell. You have a good day. I’ll pray you get over your judgmental, holier-than-thou attitude and are humbled in God’s Eye.

          • Ginnyfree

            Hello Derek. Judgemental? Why are you claiming that of me? I’ve responded to your accusations of hypocrisy against my Church. That’s all I’ve done.

            Do you want judgemental? Then read what this guy actually said and see a real act of judgement leveled at an entire class of persons who simply follow Jesus Christ faithfully:
            “THIS is the reason I no longer attend mass. The hypocrisy of the Catholic Church specifically and Christianity in general is appalling!”

            OOOOPS! The man I’m quoting is you. Congratulations! You’ve managed to judge two thousand years worth of persons and found them morally inferior to yourself such that you have no desire to worship God in the same space with them, specifically on Sundays and you want someone to prove to you why you should bother with all these morally inferior types once a week for an hour or so from Scripture. I could begin with love your neighbor, but that would seem to present a serious moral dilemma for someone such as yourself, so I won’t bother quoting the Scriptures regarding God’s Greatest Commandment. God bless. Ginnyfree.

          • You know what… you are right. I should have said “The hypocrisy of ___MOST OF THE PEOPLE WITH WHOM I HAVE COME INTO CONTACT ASSOCIATING THEMSELVES WITH___ the Catholic Church specifically and Christianity in general is appalling.”

            That was far too generalized on my part.

            Let me tell you a tale….

            I have a friend who happens to believe as I do regarding the need to attend church to get into Heaven. He’s not Catholic, bu that is of no consequence to this story. He and his wife happen to cut grass, among other odd jobs. Quite often, they can be seen cutting grass for the elderly and poor – with no pay expected or requested. One of the local church’s pastors happen to see them doing this and decided to stop and invite them to his church. No problem with that. These friends politely informed the pastor that they didn’t attend formal church services. This supposed man of God, took it upon himself to tell my friends that if they thought that they could get into Heaven by doing good acts, that they were sorely mistaken. Then he went on to say something along the lines of they would burn in Hell unless they went to church and changed their evil ways and stormed off. See, he thinks like you seem to – love your neighbor all you want, but if you want to get into Heaven, your rear had better be parked in a pew every Sunday. I am sure you will see nothing wrong with this exchange, but I find it reprehensible, especially coming from a preacher.

            > “…. but that would seem to present a serious moral dilemma for someone such as yourself.”

            Again, you don’t know me, and yet you wonder why I would call you judgmental.

          • robert

            You are going to hell, unless you turn around and backtrack, because there is absolutely no hope of salvation outside the Church. There is only one Church…it is the Catholic Church.
            . ex cathreda…”There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside which no one at all is saved. (Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, 1215)

            ex cathreda…”We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.” Pope Boniface VIII, the Bull Unum Sanctum, 1302.)

            ex cathreda…”The most Holy Roman Church firmly believes, professes and teaches that none of those existing outside the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics, can have a share in life eternal; but that they will go into the eternal fire which was prepared fir the devil and his angels, unless before death they are joined to Her; and that so important is the unity of this ecclesiastical body that only those remaining i within this unity can profit by the Sacraments of the Church unto salvation, and they alone can receive an eternal recompense for their fasts, their almsgiving, their other works of Christian piety and the duties ofa Chrisitan soldier. No one, let his almsgiving be as great as it may, no one, even if he pour out his blood for the Name of Christ, can be saved, unless he remain within the bosom and the unity of the Catholic Church. (Pope Eugene IV, the Bull Cantate Domino , 1441)

            There is no salvation outside the Catholic Church, just as there were none saved outside the Ark of Noah.

          • I am so glad that so many people here are able to know the destination of my eternal soul. That is an amazing feat since on God knows that.

          • regina cates

            Derek, these people, Robert and this “Ginnyfree” lady, are terrible internet trolls. Please do come back to the Church! She is full of sinners who are daily giving our lives to Jesus. The Eucharist is at the heart of our Faith, and the wonderful sacrament of reconciliation. You won’t find people like Robert and “Ginnyfree” there, for the most part. You may find some moms who wear jeans that may have a knee rip every so often. (-; …who are still modest and kind and loving and trying to raise their children to be followers of Jesus.

            I’ve gotten a tad snarky in this discussion, but man, it’s just hard not to when the pharisees come out in full force, telling me I’m a lost soul and such, for wearing ripped jeans. What were Robert’s words again? Oh…”poor deluded woman”, “ruinous example”. (Remember – ripped jeans.) If only you could see our beautiful family Robert, and how good and merciful God has been to us.

            Anyway Derek, please do come back – you’ll find it to be very good!

          • You know… I was, well not forced, but I went to a Catholic school for 9 years (k-8) and we attended Mass every Sunday (or Saturday). I was even an alter boy. For one reason or another, I quit going when I grew up. I guess I just didn’t like the having to do it. Back then, I was, let’s just say not the best of souls. But I can tell you my faith in God has never been stronger, now without “the Church” than it ever was then going to that school and Mass.

            My father passed away six months ago, and at the same time, my girlfriend’s relative passed away as well. So we went to two funerals within a weeks time – one Catholic, for my father, and one Baptist, for her family. The difference was like night and day. At the Catholic Mass, everyone – priest and parishioners alike – were so monotonous. It was like everyone was in a trace, just repeating lines from ingrained memories. The Baptist service, yes I know, not the true Church, but at least those people had spirit. They felt God’s presence. When I speak to God, I don’t think that God wants to hear me reading from a script. He wants me to speak what is in my heart. That is something that the Catholic Church looks down on. They want you to be a programmed automaton.

            You say that I won’t find people like them in Church. Actually.. you’re oh so wrong. Like I said, I went to Catholic school. I was, and still am, highly intelligent. I aced every subject and probably could have been anything I wanted. Just out of high school, it just so happened, all I wanted at the time was to be a construction worker. One day, I decided to stop in and see my old Priest. He took one look at me in jeans (not ripped Ginny/Robert) and a t-shirt with a leather jacket and his first reaction when he learned what I was doing for a living was “What on earth happened to you? We had such high hopes for you.” Not how are you doing, what are you doing with yourself… just total disgust. I will never forget that moment. So yeah… that kind of high-and-mighty, holier-than-thou attitude exists all the way to the top.

            I appreciate your kind words and your respect, contrary to the rest
            of the crap I’ve had to put up with here for daring to speak my mind!
            All of these people condemning their fellow man to eternal damnation are
            going to be in for a rude surprise when they have to sit before the one
            true and only Judge. You take care of yourself and may God bless you.

          • robert

            You sound as if you have been cursed.

          • Cursed?! Oh my gosh.. that is a new one! LOL

          • robert

            Your idea of the Church is heretical…here are some testimonies that the Church had a very physical aspect….
            St. Cyprian, Bishop of Carthage (d. AD 258):
            It must be understood that the bishop is in the Church and the Church in the bishop and he is not in the Church who is not with the bishop.

            Pope Leo XIII, in unambiguous language, teaches that the notion that the Church is “hidden and invisible” is a “pernicious error”:
            [T]hose who arbitrarily conjure up and picture to themselves a hidden and invisible Church are in grievous and pernicious error: as also are those who regard the Church as a human institution which claims a certain obedience in discipline and external duties, but which is without the perennial communication of the gifts of divine grace, and without all that which testifies by constant and undoubted signs to the existence of that life which is drawn from God. It is assuredly as impossible that the Church of Jesus Christ can be the one or the other, as that man should be a body alone or a soul alone. The connection and union of both elements is as absolutely necessary to the true Church as the intimate union of the soul and body is to human nature.

            Pope Pius XII says something quite similar about the notion of the Church’s being invisible:
            Hence they err in a matter of divine truth, who imagine the Church to be invisible, intangible, a something merely “pneumatological” as they say, by which many Christian communities, though they differ from each other in their profession of faith, are untied by an invisible bond.

          • | “Your idea of the Church is heretical…”

            Well, that’s OK, because at one time, Galileo’s notion that the Earth revolved around the sun and that the Earth was not the center of the universe was also considered heretical. Unless you want to make the claim that Galileo was a heretic for his now proven scientific FACT as demanded by the Church….. So I will stand by my claim that the Catholic Church – any church for that matter – is run by fallible man, as evidenced by the fact that you can only prove your point by quoting man – not God; not Biblical Scripture. Man, by his very imperfect nature, corrupts everything that he touches.

          • Ginnyfree

            Derek: “Well, that’s OK, because at one time, Galileo’s notion that the Earth revolved around the sun and that the Earth was not the center of the universe was also considered heretical” WRONG!

            Derek, I’m going to give you a little of the basics: The Church rightfully governs the faithful in matters of faith and morals, religious matters. A person who persists with heretical views regarding professed religious matters such as a vasectomy being a matter of conscience and therefore a private matter can be formally declared a heretic after investigation and failure to accept the Church’s corrective actions. This is a matter of both faith and morals and the Church has every right to adjudicate in such matters. However, all matters of science are beyond the jurisdiction of the Church. The Church never makes declarations regarding whether or not any scientific matters are heretical. They simply cannot be heretical at all. Heresy is about faith, science is about science. The Church cannot declare any science heretical. It can however, investigate the facts of a particular scientific finding and if it determines these things are a danger to the faithful, it will issue a warning as they should. They are among other things those charged by God to guard with their very lives, the sheep of his fold. But they will never declare a matter of science a heresy because heresy ONLY deals with our religion and its practice.

            Since you don’t know what the facts are surrounding the case of Galileo, and prefer instead the baloney you get fed by anti-catholic detractors who care little about what they present as true history, well then I’m sorry for you. The Truth will set you free. You need to learn a few things. It is growing too obvious your theology comes from a mix of Chick tracts, the History Channel and Calvary Chapel’s Bible Plan of Salvation for Dummies textbook. Get the facts before you state falsehoods as facts. God bless. Ginnyfree.

          • https://duckduckgo.com/?q=galileo+heretic&t=h_&ia=web

            I think you need to do your own research instead of believing the lies that the Catholic Church teaches regardless of the facts.

            You might actually find this – http://www.catholiceducation.org/en/controversy/common-misconceptions/the-galileo-affair.html – an interesting read. One line, in particular – “Galileo was finally condemned by the Holy Office as “vehemently suspected of heresy.” And this if from the mouths of the Catholic Church itself.

          • Ginnyfree

            Derek, I have read extensively on this subject and to put it bluntly, I am right and you are wrong. There, I said it: the forbidden phrase in the arena of apologetics. But it ends the conversation which is my desire. There are many “scholars” in the world whose scholarship is bogus and there many more who fall for their garbage. They make lots of money. Some get exposed, some get away with it in this life, but they won’t pass the final exam. Some continue peddling their brand of baloney all their lives knowing full well they are perpetrating a scam on others. Then there is flat out simony, the peddling of phony miracles and cures and the seerer of the week with just as phony apparitions. There is a favorite true scholar of mine who you may want to listen to for a while and since you shared a source from your side of the planet with me, I’ll share something from my side of the planet as well: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wxddfx-qX1c The video is a full 11 minutes long but pretty much debunks your story of Galileo. You could also check this one out: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCiYNKjd0Xvj5GE5dr-9n65A There you will find some very fine talks by two authentice scholars, Charles Coulombe and William Biersach on a broad rage of subjects including quite a few Catholic controversies, including some within the Church and many outside her pervue. You could learn something from these guys and that is their intention. http://www.tumblarhouse.com/ I sincerely hope you take the time to at least watch the first video. You’ll learn something and hopefully not try to publically sound so silly in presenting as facts things that are truly scams meant to calumniate the Church of God and draw persons away from his flock. God doesn’t like that dear man. God bless. Ginnyfree.

          • You are right about one thing… you cannot argue with someone who is “right” based on a small handful of opinions when the overwhelming majority of the evidence, including that from within the Church itself, points to the contrary. Don’t worry… I’m done.

          • Derek, are you another Protestant visitor here? I’ve felt welcome at this site but I think our place in a discussion of what Catholics wear in *their* church meetings is as students/observers.

          • Actually, technically, I’m Catholic. I just do not go to Church nor do I believe everything that comes out of the Church just because the (fallible) pope says so. I wasn’t telling people what to wear in church, though… only that rips in your jeans are not the damnation of your soul and that did not sit too good with the holier-than-thou’s.

        • robert

          This explains everything….you’ve apostatized and grace has been cut off from you, as you despise Chirst’s Church and Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, and thus, despise Him, as He is inseperable from the Mass. You have returned to the vomit from which you had been retrieved from….this explains what has happened to you…. Hebrews 6:4.

          • Because I think spreading the Word of God is more important than impress my fellow humans? So be it.

      • Rose Charles

        As a Catholic we must boast of doing positive things that build not of having nine children but not guiding them properly think again

    • J.A.V.R.

      Regina, the Pharisees did everything the law of Moses dictated too; you can go to church every day and still be lost. You could still be lost not because if your ripped jeans, but because of your vanity and pride.

      John Horvat explains why wearing ripped jeans is immodest and backs his argument with quotes from a great Doctor of the Catholic Faith and you say he’s wrong because you find your ripped jeans “cute and in style”.

      You need to he more humble and, if you don’t agree with Horvat, research the topic, but coming out and boasting how great of a Catholic you are and still wear them therefore he’s wrong is extremely prideful of you.

      Also, who cares if this drives people away from the Church: The Church is not a social club. God wants all of His children to be saved, but Jesus Himself, when he spoke the truth unfiltered and unhindered and people started to leave him, turned and asked his apostles if they wanted to leave too. He didn’t pleaded for them to stay or anything like it nor did he changed the way He said things so people wouldn’t leave Him. As followers of Christ, we must do the same.

      • SHE needs to be more humble!? Just for the record, Jesus also said that you should take the plank out of your own eye before you go trying to remove the splinter in thy brother’s eye. But I guess that bit of wisdom is inconvenient when it comes to condemning others.

        • J.A.V.R.

          That doesn’t mean we cannot denounce when something is wrong. What did John the Baptist was that Christ Himself said “among those born of women there has not arisen anyone greater than John the Baptist” ? He was a prophet, a denouncer. The same man that called out King Herod and called him an adulterer and that he needed to repent.

          When we are baptized we’re anointed priests, kings and PROPHETS. It’s is our job as baptized to also denounce what is wrong.

          When Christ says to take out the plank out of your own eye before you go removing the splinter of thy brother’s eye, He is referring to the Pharisees and the people that only denounce the sins in others and believe themselves as pure or sinless and can’t recognize their own sins ; this DOESN’T mean we cannot​ denounce or give correction to.

          • KareemAbdul

            Sounds like Spiritual Works of Mercy

            That said, we’re all headed in the same direction, so we must correct one another with charity.

          • robert

            We have an obligation to….

          • KareemAbdul

            God bless you, Robert. Go in peace.

        • robert

          What plant would you like to see removed from JAVR’s eye?

      • Rose Charles

        Well said

      • robert

        On target…..you’ve peeled the scab off to reveal the pudrid puss of the infection….pride. What a mother and example this poor deluded woman must be…give her time, and in some few years, when her children return with ruined lives due to her ruinous example, she will have no one to blame but herself.

        • regina cates

          Robert we are talking about jeans with knee rips. And the above is what you’ve deteriorated into? You are nothing but pure crazy.

    • Rose Charles

      I think you missed the boat what is the church about is it numbers or faithfulness think about that what did pope Francis. say about numbers?

    • MC

      Regina, I think it’s interesting that you (correctly) denounce “the mire and chaos” of pop culture and call others to see the truth, but don’t see that current trends in fashion (such as ripped jeans) come out of the decadent pop culture to which you refer. How can you show young people the truth when you follow aspects of the culture you want them to reject? As Catholics we need to reject the current culture where it has gone wrong, including certain fashions. I think many of us suffer from some degree of blindness brought on by being constantly surrounded by the “mire and chaos” so I don’t blame you for not seeing this, I am still discovering and working out my many blind spots as I go along. Fashion trends are part of the entire package pop culture is trying to sell us. Sometimes I have to forego some item I find “cute” in favor of modesty. Over time I’ve found that those formerly “cute”
      items appeal to me less and less. It’s a sacrifice that leads to something better. Mortifying one’s vanity and will can be a positive exercise and a little penance never hurt anyone.

  • jeddrich

    Beyond this point, there is too much of the cult of the casual nowadays, in particular wearing clothes (like jeans) in formal settings when such items of apparel are more appropriate for yard work or farming or ranching or sports or other recreation. People should dress up for such occasions as Church and dining at restaurants or even shopping. I always wear a tie and jacket and dress slacks when teaching on the college level, but hardly any other male professor does. The women dress in a much more professional manner.

    • reginaldon

      I see many ‘preachers’ in the most casual of dress – is it good or bad – maybe the poor or unchurched feel more accepted.

      • reginaldon

        As a Protestant pastor I always tried to appear modestly but smartly dessed.

  • Sharon Zoeller

    My parents, who were born on farms during 1997-1918, never wore jeans. They had a reason and their reason is, what? I can’t remember. I think it had to do with the depression era. I wore jeans; hip huggers, bell bottoms, and farmer’s jeans, painter’s overhauls and now, slims. I don’t wear these jeans out for they are good jeans that I got for a bargain price. I would like not to wear jeans. What is the replacement for them? Today, going to a nature preserve, I pulled out the jeans again, to protect myself from mosquitos. I think the situation has to do with jeans themselves, like a work of art, they are iconically American and the one thing American made that is still affordable. The muddied jeans are washable probably. As I said, it is “wearing jeans” “American made” “artsy.” Accept it as such. If they want protection from bugs, they will wear the right stuff, and for Mass as well.

    • jeddrich

      There are plenty of styles of dress slacks that are not jeans. This issue does indeed go way back. I am in my late 60s and remember when my baby-boomer classmates in college (supposedly all non-conformists) would wear jeans (sometimes torn) in the early 70s, but I never cared for the look of them (still don’t) and always wore dress pants (I wonder who was the renegade here?). For one thing, they are simply too informal or casual for many occasions, excluding of course yard work or ranching, farming, and outdoor recreation such as hiking or boating (for which I still wear dress slacks). We need to return to cultural formality in many respects.

      • Why? What is so much better about formality? Don’t get me wrong, I still say “yes sir” and “yes ma’am”. Having respect – which is what this generation is missing – is not the same as being all formal and snooty. Nothing personal meant there. It’s just that being “proper” does not make one moral or righteous. Back in the olden days, some of the most heinous sinners where some of the most proper citizens.

  • RCQ157@yahoo.com

    I was brought up in a poor family, didn’t have much but appreciated what I had so this new fashion about torn clothes and paying a lot of money for it does not turn me on. The only time I wore torn clothes was when I worked as a welder, but often times I would patch it as holes and shredded fabric is a fire hazard. Anyway after it really gets really bad I had to toss it in the garbage. I am not into the new fab of people wearing torn clothes or shredded clothes that costs a lot of money, but one can just buy a cheap pair of pants splash some acid on the fabric and get the same results as the most expensive jeans out their that the crooks sell and their are plenty of them out there. I guess todays generation don’t care about the way they look or the type of clothes they wear in public if they did this raggy thing that’s happening would not exist. Also if these people wanted to wear these clothes I would tell them to get a job to pay for it, but they would not get to wear it in my house.

    • Flame

      I’m with you, RCQ. I too came from modest beginnings where my mom sewed for herself, for me, and even was known to make suits for my brother and dad. (Her grandfather was a tailor.)

      I have ancient tee-shirts that have worn holes in the knit. I keep them laundered and wear them for sleep. That way, if I must step outside briefly, I’m pretty close to dressed — more so than if I had on nightgowns etc. That way I get more wear out of them, and once they’re too ragged for that, they can be used as dust rags or to wrap stuff for moving or storage.

      But when I actually dress for the day, I want my jeans clean and free of any rips. I have been known to embroider colorful patches to sew over any holes, which is another way of making a bit of fashion statement, but to me, it announces thrift and covers me. And I don’t wear those to church.

      When I do shop for clothes, I waltz right past all that ripped and torn stuff, same as I go by the stuff that’s falling off the shoulders or looks like an old rag thrown around the body.

      Thank goodness I can sew, so that when the stores have no such choices, I will still be modest. I may not be “current,” but I can still be fashionable.

      • Another Martha

        Flame — are you married? I certainly hope your husband is not having to see you in ripped t-shirts in the bedroom. I’m not suggesting you “dress up” to go to bed – but a healthy marriage shows respect for the other by not looking like we are dressed in (almost literally) rags to be in the marriage bed. You might want to reconsider — are you being penny wise and pound foolish? Go back to the nightgown. 😉

        If you are not married — then you owe yourself the same level of respect. 🙂

        • Flame

          Not any more. If I were, many other things would be different too.

        • De gustibus…I didn’t share his bed, but I used to date a fellow who collected T-shirts and always wanted me to put on one of his latest. With skirts or jeans, for baby-sitting His Mama’s foster children, movies, restaurants, sightseeing, and generally being Bright Young Things around town. Usually they were sports motif shirts that he’d worn once and washed. But yes, the idea of sharing T-shirts was a bonding ritual for him. So I wouldn’t be too quick to deride women wearing T-shirts in the marriage bed.

        • Jerryb53

          Martha I think your taking this a little too far. The “marriage bed” really! Now your making judgments on what married people wear too bed. I don’t think Jesus would approve of this. Flame said they were clean. I want the government out of my bedroom and I certainly want my neighbor out too.

    • Hope-Has-Arrived-2017

      The wealthy wearing expensive ripped clothes in the presence of anyone hungry and/or wearing thrift-store rags – will be judged accordingly.

      • The fun part is that in a nice neighborhood those “thrift-store rags” can include end-of-the-season designer styles. Woot!

        I made it a trademark in the 1990s when the fashion look was comfortable and, to my eyes, flattering for me. I buy only shoes and underwear off the rack, everything else in aid of charities I respect. I had literally the same dresses on which embassy wives spent thousands, and never spent as much as $100 a year on clothes, and most of it went to Amvets, Purple Heart, Salvation Army, Prevention of Blindness, Teen Challenge, and similar causes.

        The wealthy buying *anything* off the rack will be…quietly…smiled at, behind their backs, by this rich diplomat’s now penniless widow. Well, *some*body had to wear my clothes once and donate them to the store that hires those students and immigrants to raise money for charity.

      • Jerryb53

        My sentiments exactly.

  • Stewart Davies

    “Custom-ripped’ clothing; young women wearing ridiculously short skirts and (what look like) army boots; the not-too-long-past trendy wearing of pants worn so low as to reveal a vast expanse of underwear …..etc etc. As far as ‘fashion’ is concerned, this protracted age is ‘the Age of Ugliness’ and it shows no sign of ending any time soon. And as the article points out, people are so determined to demonstrate their individuality by slavishly conforming to the same appalling dress standards. St Jacinta Marto conveyed conveyed to us Heaven’s displeasure with contemporary fashions a hundred years ago.

  • mister malted

    Moral? Immoral? There is certainly room for debate. But stupid? No room here. Definitely, stupid.

    • Have you not read the comments? There is no room for debate. We are wrong and they are right. Period….

      • robert

        No room for debate? Aren’t you doing that right now? No one is stopping you from disagreeing.You can still continue to post your arguments. No one is stopping them. It is obviously being debated here on this forum.

  • Wolemai

    I strongly believe that the coming of ripped, deliberately worn out, trashy looking clothes is a sign of a society moving to the final stages of decadence. For anyone to think that such a fashion is something to show off, is a sign of a society where “bad” is now “good” and “lies” are now “truth.”
    Further, to find that fashion primarily, though not exclusively, among the young women, is a sign of how feminism, true womanhood, is being completely abandoned.
    The same young women are now embracing tattoo disfigurement all over their bodies, with multiple ear piercings and bizarre hairstyles.
    Satan is certainly making his presence felt in our modern world. The word “taste” is now meaningless, just as the word “truth” is becoming meaningless.

  • Jeannie Keilt

    It’s the proletarianization of American society. No aristocracy, no manners, no standards, a nation full of tattooed debt-serfs. This is what happens when so-called “Dark Forces” take over society: massive debt, usury, assassination of real leaders, deteriorated educational system, and premature sexuality and promiscuity.
    A truly awakened Catholicism would go a long way in making a difference, but it may not be enough. We are dealing with the occult penetration of society. The battle between good and evil is a real one.
    By the way, I’m Caryl, not Jeannie–but Jeannie is my friend.

    • reginaldon

      Not ‘Catholicism’ but ‘Christianity’.

      • robert

        Catholicism is the only true Christianity.

        • Alfred White

          Rhubarb! Get out in the World and don’t have a closed mind – The World will not get ‘back to Order’ until people like you open your hearts to other Christians.

          • robert

            There are over 50,000 different Protestant sects…..there is only one Church which Jesus started….all the Prot assemblies were started by men/and a few women….they were started long after Jesus started His Church. The Catholic Church is the only one that dates back to Jesus.
            So, it’s not about opening one’s mind, or their hearts….it’s about accepting historical and theological facts. The world is out of order for the precise reason that people no longer believe, by in large, that the truth can be found as their are so many aspirants to the title “Church”. They believe that it is not possbile to find, and thus, it does not matter, and thus, it doesn’t matter what one thinks/believes, since all these 50,000 prot assemplies speak so many variantions of teachings…..their is only one true Church, the Catholic Church, outside of which, there is absolutely no hope of salvation…and that, my freind, would include…you.

            Now…take those silly jeans with tears and holes in them off, and gain some dignity.

          • reginaldon

            Robert, you show crass ignorance of the history of the Early Church before Constantine and the proof the power corrupts. You willingly ignore the abuses and cruelty that the Catholic Church engendered – the holocaust on the Huguenots, the Inquisition et al, and up to very recently the child abuse committed by its ‘celibate’ priests. When I was at college the Christian Society said all were welcome but they drew the line at Jehovah’s Witnesses and Catholics. Notwithstanding all this, I have very good friends who are ardent Catholics and Cardinal Suenens showed there is spiritual life in the Catholic Church and I tell my Protestant colleagues that this is so. Sadly your outbursts defeat your cause.

          • robert

            I believe these offences, the ones that stick, anyhow, were committed by the ChurchMEN, not the Church. You must learn to make distinctions. The Church teaches with her infallibly defined dogmas, but, as in the case of the OT Church, the leaders are not always faithful….even Jesus had His Escariot. The Church of Jesus Christ is One…(infallibly defined by the Christ, and the Apostles), thus it is an easy task to determine that the Prot sects, all 50,000 + of them, divided as they are, cannot be the true Churches, as they also teach so many contradictory teachings that each one requires you to believe. It is a true man made tower of Babel. Now, please, try to contain your self. Have you not heard that the gates of hell will not prevail against His Church? Yet, the Prot sects are in a constant state of flux…one day this…the next day that….truly a house built upon sand.

          • reginaldon

            Robert you keep digging yourself into deeper holes. Now the Catholic Church is not guilty only ‘Church men’ – presumably the Borgias and many Cardinals. Only twenty miles from here a lady was burnt at the stake – her crime – possessing a bible in her own English language.

          • TesaBess333

            Reginaldon is correct—it is Church doctrine that the Arc of Peter is the only Christian Church (all other reject part of Jesus’ teaching, making them non-Christian in the literal sense). See St. Cyprian, Pope Innocent III (1208), the profession of faith of the Fourth Lateran Council (1215), the bull Unam sanctam of Pope Boniface VIII (1302), and the profession of faith of the Council of Florence (1442). The axiom “No salvation outside the Church” has been frequently repeated over the centuries in different terms by the ordinary magisterium.

  • crockett

    If I opt to wear my comfortable torn jeans it is my choice . We all have a right to wear what we want and not be what others want us to be . That makes everyone unique . My torn and worn jeans are from hard work and are a part of me , not you . Maybe I could just sell them on E Bay and make money . Be yourself and get on with what makes you happy and feel good . This is America so be what you are and not what others want you to be .

    • TesaBess333

      No one is questioning your choice, but the point is this particular choice does not portray modesty (wearing torn clothing to do dirty, labor-intensive jobs is not the issue, nor wearing clothing until one wears holes in them). Deportment in public speaks volumes. This website is not about doing whatever one feels like, American or not. It is about a Catholic manner of life.

      • crockett

        Look Tes , not all are Catholic goody two shoes such as you see yourself to be .

  • Sam Alexander Shanks

    As much as I want to agree I don’t understand how wearing jeans that are ripped at the knees is immodest? I would understand if the rips were in the rear or near the crotch but some images of saints such as Saint Rocco and Saint Peregrine show these saints showing off their knee in iconography and this isn’t deemed immodest, I can’t quite see the difference if someone could please explain it to me.

    God bless you all.
    Sam

    • Just… because. They say so. I made the same point and I was told that apparently I didn’t read the article. This is nothing more than looking down on others, something I might add that Jesus was very much against.

  • Bo

    I think that if the holes are in places that inappropriately display skin or are close to private areas, then, yes, holes in clothes are not holy. But, there is so much more wrong with society that it is specious to make gross generalizations over what people decide to wear. It may be imprudent to spent $400 on the “worn” look, but I have met many, many nattily dressed immoral men and women.

  • David M.Lord

    Yeah, sorry to say the gals like those! Usually really tight with strategic horizontal slices up and down the legs! Got some myself to use as work clothes, but not torn in immodest places! Put the tears in them myself too, accidently! Even got a few chain saw cuts in there.. Yikes!

  • MoriaThornycroft

    It is disrespectful to others to deliberately dress in a slovenly manner. A Catholic has a duty to edify, not disedify, those whom God places in his path. Just as a rundown residence with overgrown grass, trash in the yard, and broken windows is unfair to the neighbors who are keeping their properties in decent condition, so those who dress without self-respect exhibit a lack of civility towards others.

    • Rose Charles

      I agree

  • Anthony Rader

    Well, it may be immodest, but it seems just plain stupid. Next thing in fashion might be to hang around the railway tracks with a carefully crafted half empty bottle of hooch hanging out a ripped muddy jean pocket. Goes with the unshaven look. Classy!

  • Chris Byrne

    I’m so glad someone finally wrote about this horrible “fashion.” People walk down the street wearing these jeans, thinking they are the height of fashion when, in fact, they look dirty and grungy. They will probably cringe in a few years, after this stupid concept goes out of “fashion” when they think back on how they looked. Some people can’t think for themselves. They would rather blindly follow like a bunch of sheep. Most people have to work hard for their money and spending it on this garbage is unconscionable!

  • Ginnyfree

    The Gifts of the Spirit we celebrate our Church being adorned with on this most festive of days of the Liturgical year are our true garments. These are the wedding garments we will be judged on as the Gospel parable explains. Piety is one of these gifts and among its benefits is modesty in dress. Matthew 22: 12-14 “He said to him, ‘My friend, how is it that you came in here without a wedding garment?’ But he was reduced to silence. Then the king said to his attendants, ‘Bind his hands and feet, and cast him into the darkness outside, where there will be wailing and grinding of teeth.’ Many are invited, but few are chosen.” You should really read the whole parable of the wedding. Pray to receive the gifts the Holy Spirit brings. Without Him you can do nothing. May the charity of God animate your hearts to see with pity those who lack the Spirit and so cannot see their lack of modesty. They are naked and without shame because they lack the Holy Spirit who draws their attention to their sins. One other gift of that same Spirit is Fear of the Lord. I like it best when it is listed first because it gives birth to the others if acted upon. It is way out of fashion to talk about this authentic Gift of the Spirit and perhaps this article is proof that all Fear of the Lord has gone from their eyes as we get told in the OT. If one truly has a righteous Fear of the Lord, then one’s life will get ordered to that gift in no time at all. Dressing right will become natural. Nuff said. God bless. Ginnyfree.

    • Margaret

      In the Ukrainian and Byzantine Catholic Churches, Matthew 22: 2-14 is the Gospel for the 15th Sunday after Pentecost.

      The “wedding garment” is sanctifying grace, without which one cannot enter heaven. If a person dies in the state of mortal sin, they are cast out “into the darkness, where there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.” (from the Epistle)

  • Flame

    How timely this article. Dressing in church has become so casual. Just this morning I was selected to be the lay reader for the lessons for this important day (Pentecost). I was encouraged to wear red in honor of the occasion, and I had just such a blouse — tho bought for a different occasion. I take pains to dress for church. I think God deserves that respect.

    Then I watched the 3 men who were to assist the pastor in serving communion. One was in business attire but without his jacket. The last one was in slacks and sweater (he has a certain disability and can be forgiven). Finally, a perfectly capable gentleman in faded jeans and a knit shirt. All conducted themselves politely and efficiently, but I felt almost as if the church had not been prepared properly. So much respect has been lost in recent years.

    I think back to a certain young woman at a church I’ve left. She came regularly with skirts halfway up her thighs. On certain days, she would be an assisting minister, as her father was before her, but although the assistants in that church wore robes for their service, it was still disconcerting to watch this gal with the tattoo on her ankle walk by in her white robe wearing flip-flops to pass the chalice.

    I don’t know that I would insist on going back to all women wearing dresses, hats and gloves, as it was when I was growing up, but can’t we at least leave our work clothes at home and wear our “Sunday-go-to-meetin'” clothes?

    • In that unpublished speculative novel I’ve been writing on for years, in the alternative world everybody removes all shoes, washes their feet, and puts on a long loose undyed robe so they all look alike in church services. The robes are stored in the church basements and picked off racks as people come into church, like choir robes in our world.

      Not all of the details of that fictional society are things I’d like to experience in the real world, but if I knew of a church that had that rule, I’d want to visit it.

      • Ginnyfree

        Priscilla, it might interest you to know that a few years back I had one of the most awesome experiences of my life – I got to volunteer at a local house of the Missionaries of Charity, St. Teresa of Calcutta’s Sisters. Shoes were NOT worn in Chapel at all. We lined them all up outside in the little hallway BEFORE entering. Guests also complied as well as did most of the Priests who served Mass for the Sisters in their convent chapels. The reason for this is found in Exodus 3:5 “And he said: Come not nigh hither, put off the shoes from thy feet: for the place whereon thou standest is holy ground.” I loved it! I still pray without shoes at home and if I’ve got sandals or clogs on my feet at Adoration, most of the time if you look under my pew, they’re to the side and you’ll see my socks. The Sister’s “converted” me! To this day I feel much better about myself praying before God without my shoes and do so at home. It just feels “righter” that way. When people sometimes see my tootsies at Church and I notice they are noticing, I pray a quick one to hope they aren’t offended in any way by my little gesture before God. There seems to be a small movement of the heart inside when you do so and my heart remembers it, so off come the clogs at Adoration. I hardly ever let them slip at Sunday Mass, though. My toes might get squished and my shoes would get kicked three pews away. You should try it at an Adoration chapel near you soon. But be cautioned, you may not want to put them back on again to leave. Then again, it may not seem “right” for you at all, but you won’t know until you try it once. If you ever have the opportunity to pray in a Convent of the Missionaries of Charity, you will be asked to remove your shoes before entering. Even when the Sisters are simply cleaning the Chapel or paying a visit, their sandals are off and out in the hallway. Nuff said. God bless. Ginnyfree.

  • Kooter

    Many of today’s parents or guardians of teenagers who are going to school with holes in jeans, stretch pants they have been poured in, pants worn 6″ below the butt line, earrings in noses, lips, tongues, navels and tattoos all over the body need to know about their responsibilities as such. Corporate greed and the “immoral entertainment industry”, along with irresponsible parents, are the reason for young ones going over the line of modesty. Ultimately, we must blame our government for allowing such atrocities.

  • Lala Land

    When my (now) 24-year-old twins would come out of their rooms ready for school a few years ago, I cringed. The clothes I had so carefully hung up or folded were masses of wrinkles! On top of that, their socks NEVER matched. Apparently, EVERYONE wore wrinkled clothes to school, and no one wore matching socks! Oh no, not MY kids! The socks I could live with, but the wrinkled clothes were not going to be a “thing” for my kids. I didn’t believe them, but I learned that they were telling me the truth. I’m wondering if the mismatched socks and the wrinkled clothing started with busy parents who worked outside the home and had no time to get the clothes from the dryer (and the kids wouldn’t help) and everyone just picked from there what they could find, the children didn’t want to put away their clothing when they took it to their rooms and it ended up on the floor, wrinkled, or why this nasty-looking stuff started. All I know is it drives me crazy, especially now that my children are grown and sometimes STILL dress like this! That they don’t wear clothes that look like they were picked up from a mud puddle and pants full of holes is my only solace.

    • The attention you gave their clothes rewarded them for wearing those clothes.

      One of my sisters, both of whom were the “too good-looking for their own good” type anyway, wanted to wear a miniskirt…those Madison Avenue Misogynists just keep screaming “Miniskirts are back!!!!!” every year, although it’s never true. So she bought one, she wore it, we walked to the grocery store, and a guy in a car rolled down the window and yelled “Cuanta preciosa?” at us. That explained it to her…other teenaged girls might have said “Que preciosa!” but men would be saying “Cuanta preciosa?” No more miniskirts for her.

      But if I’d said, “That skirt looks trashy,” then wearing it would have been an act of rebellion against the older people who just don’t understaaand, blah blah. I did once say to the other sister, when she put on her “full war paint” before a date, “You’re lucky Dad can’t see you going out like that.” Only because a friend my age had just whispered to me, “Your parents let her go out like that?” She not only went out “like that”…she later married that guy and wound up divorced with four kids.

      I’ve learned. If you want to make teenagers claim that jeans with the knees ripped out are comfortable (instead of binding, the way they actually do) until for all we know they may actually start to believe it, you make an issue out of their wearing jeans with the knees ripped out. If you want to encourage a taste for nicer styles, you wait till they put on something of which you approve and then say, convincingly, “In that outfit you look twenty-five!”

  • Phil Alcoceli

    There is certainly an aspect of demonic inmodesty associated with ripped jeans which are are patently stupid and are presented as fun and harmless and which are just like the introductory marijuana of immoral dress. From there mainstreamed stupidity goes down to yoga pants that look like paint on a naked body, pants that show clearly the shape of women’s genitals and, of course, body paint on totally naked bodies. Sin is stupid and stupid is the door to sin. Dressing modestly is in itself and act of courage, wisdom, truth and love for the body God gave us.

  • Charles E Flynn

    Ordinarily, I would enjoy reading the preceding seventy-six comments. However, not in a position to argue with St. Thomas Aquinas and John Horvat II, I have been too busy “deaccessioning” the following to read the comments:

    1. One shetland wool sweater sold by L.L. Bean, made in Hong Kong, with holes in the elbows, a hole in the back, a tear at one cuff, and a frayed neck. Was worn only “around the house”. Lasted many years. No comparable product sold today by original vendor.

    2. One Pendleton Umatilla cloth shirt, with more than one iron-on patch. Easily replaced from original vendor.

    3. One pair of Birkenstock Arizona model sandals, with deteriorating cork edges and a crack in the sole. Easily replaced from original vendor.

    4. Several pairs of Patagonia socks, now that sock-darning is out of favor. Easily replaced from original vendor.

    Looking forward to email from Scotland tomorrow morning about replacing the shetland wool sweater.

    • Phil Alcoceli

      I don’t think John Horvat II or anyone on this forum is advocating censorship or criticism of people who wear clothing, sandals or socks with some small holes, stains, etc. in them as if the poor or the needy (or people just relaxed in comfortable, well worn attire) are immorally dressed. I gladly wear some comfy items like that.

      The fact is, though, that all legitimate and good things taken to the EXTREME become sin and are toxic and damaging to society. That has been Satan’s strategy since the begining when he posed as the best, most fun and most sympathetic advocate for Adam and Eve against the “stingy”, “controlling”, “prudish” God. Satan impersonates God and it’s time to gut out his false legitimacy and his very real stupidity, his two doors to sin.

  • Jim too

    As a young boy I often tore the knees out of my dungarees. Mom always had iron – on patches to prolong the life of the dungarees. How times have changed !

  • Robert Lincoln

    Amen. My grandchildren will probably never speak to me again when I forward this subject to them. Amen.

  • Teresa Greenway

    God made us naked and no one thinks the aborigines are immodest in their nakedness. As long as we strive to love one another, let’s not get caught up with plank in our eyes as we look at our neighbors clothing style. I would hope God cares more about what’s in our hearts than what’s in our closets.

    • Phil Alcoceli

      The aborigines argument is a burnt out one. Should we all color our skin blue, live in trees and wear only loinclothes or nothing at all? Should we forego progress in the name of non-existent, fantasy saturated, Disney-like past of pure native harmony that never existed? The noble savage argument is bogus and there were plenty of strife, rape, abuse, suffering and war among many natives that is all glossed over (long before whites showed up).

      Yes, God does care more about the heart (and so do I by my late father’s amazing example), and a noble heart is expressed by the purity of how we live, and how well we discriminate between good and evil, strongly loving the first and strongly shunning the other. The heart is not a sentimental fantasy either. Some of the greatest, most despicable and most heinous evil today has been pushed in the name of sentimentality and “the heart”.

      • Teresa Greenway

        I think that nit picking everything every does is the burnt out fantasy of a “better than thou” attitude. The Pharisees were good at nit picking and following the letter of the law too. It gets old. Work on attitudes, (beatitudes), sharing, loving and forgiving (the heinous things), instead of pointing out failures, flaws and regulations. Like I mentioned, the plank in our eyes.

        • Phil Alcoceli

          Nitpicking, REALLY? For the confused, the indoctrinated in lies, the perverted, and the sinful, every grain of Jesus’ Truth is “nitpicking”. We are ALL sinners (including myself) but I deeply and greatly appreciate God’s interference and Jesus’ “nitpicking” as you call it. I didn’t mention any laws and regulations, only Truth. If the arrogance of some is a “plank in their eyes”, then self-righteous sentimentality and fanatical, destructive false compassion is the WHOLE FOREST.

          • regina cates

            Wait, we are still talking about jeans with knee rips, right? Teresa, you’re right. Don’t let the trolls bother you.

          • Phil Alcoceli

            Yes, we are talking about ripped jeans and other stupid fashions like it designed to stupidify and manipulate young (and older) people and also how stupid is always the door to sin and social decay whether it comes through fashion, activism, politics, false religions, New Age, etc. Christianity knows it’s all connected and we don’t need New Age to know that. As far as you suporting Teresa in her error, hey, be my guest, it’s the mutual-admiration-society when the god is not the Pure Jesus calling us to transcend our low appetites but the sinful human ego and its infantile and sentimental fixation on its own waste.

        • robert

          What you are peddling is license to do whatever one wishes to do….”I gotta be me…I gotta be free”. People with your mindset are only one of the cancers of our culture. You are the one who appears as the pharisees….whitened scepulcres full of dead men’s bones….

    • Ginnyfree

      Ah.the noble savage that the Enlightenment used to seduce others into accepting a “no rules” lifestyle, anarchy disguised as democracy and the elimination of the ruling classes! That noble savage had to rules to bind him at all and no God either. He was often presented as if he were living in Eden on earth. The Church caught on to that misrepresentation of the noble savage and has debunked the myth surrounding him. God does care what’s in one’s closet and how one dresses for worship. I suggest you make a study of the Old Testament requirements for garments that had to been prepared and worn by those who ministered in the Temple. God’s people Israel were also required to clothe themselves in specific ways and wash ceremoniously before worship. These ways of demonstrating piety were adopted and adapted for Christian worship and remain pleasing to God. His opinion of your clothing is one opinion that counts. Common sense is not limited to Catholics. Women know the effect their dress has on men and some use it to effect. Although barely mentioned in the article, the misuse of our womanly gifts is immoral and unseemly both in the eyes of women who know better and God. God bless. Ginnyfree.

    • robert

      Teresa, please…”to whom much is given, much is required” our Lord said…..not much has been given to the aborigines, much has been given to this so-called Christian nation, and thus, much is required. We’ve been given light…for the sake of decency and thankfulness, let us utilize it. The aborigines will be judged, along with us, for what we did with the gift of light, and that includes you and I. There’s nothing hypocritical about calling our nation back to decency and modesty of dress. Would you try to correct a young woman who parades her flesh in public in panties and bra only? That would not be hypocritical of you if you did….it would, however, prove that you cared for her, by attempting to draw her back to decency.

  • Capt_J@sea

    Wealthy people paying heavy bucks so they can look like poor people who can’t afford new jeans – makes sense. I mean, it fits in with the modern reversals of moral and ethical values, doesn’t it?

    I see it as the the old, “Emperor’s new clothes” syndrome. Only the chic, sophisticated and modish ones can see the beauty of these clothes – the rest of us unfashionable, styleless clods just see a bunch of outrageously overpriced, ratty clothes. Me, I see a naked emperor.

  • Fish More

    Except at the Holy Sacrifice of the Mass, I am what the author would likely consider an overly-casual dresser. Despite that, I do not disagree with anything he wrote.

    The author presented rational arguments for his assertion that deliberately wearing distressed or dirty clothing is immodest. Commenters attempting to rebut him merely made assertions. They did not present any reasoning worthy of supporting those assertions.

    The distressed clothing trend discussed here is, of course, but one symptom of a much broader malaise. Here are some scriptural passages to consider, and the reasons that they are pertinent.

    Regarding the modesty argument, please consider Matthew 5:48. “… You are to be perfect, as your heavenly Father is perfect.” By definition God is infinite in all His perfections. As His creatures we are called to emulate Him inasmuch as our nature permits. Thus, deliberately espousing imperfection for it’s own sake is against His holy will. Rebellion against this truth can be seen in many other areas, such architecture and art. Artificially distressed clothing is merely one of many modern trends
    that are part of a more general trend against excellence. Many of these
    trends are much worse than distressed clothing. But all these trends
    come from the same source, and the source is not God. Therefore they are all to be rejected.

    Regarding the purpose argument, we can look at Isaiah 5:20. “Woe upon you, the men who call evil good, and good evil; whose darkness
    is light, whose light darkness; who take bitter for sweet, and sweet for
    bitter!” Clothing that betrays its proper function is a failure. Also, wearing
    clothes that deliberately belie one’s station is dishonest.

    I do wear shorts to work in the summer, as I often ride a bicycle. I have no plans to swap that attire for a suit. But I would not wear dirty or torn clothes out in public. More generally, any clothing, hairstyle, body modification, etc. that screams “Hey everybody, look at me!” can’t help a person on the path to Heaven because it isn’t humble.

  • 2alphonsus

    What does the Bible say about men dressing like women, and women dressing like men? Deut. 22:5, “A woman shall not be clothed with man’s apparel, neither shall a man use woman’s apparel: for he that doeth these things is abominable before God.” This is why some good women are returning to dresses only. Jeans actually look tacky and repugnant on women, not attractive. And why is it that the jeans on a woman are always tight, and those on a man are most usually loose? I think Kimberly Hahn had it right when she said, “It’s a woman’s nature to seduce.”

    • robert

      The flower must attract the bee, in order to appear to be the victem, when all along it is the one who does the seducing in order to pollenate. A man who wears women’s cloths used to called gay….or queer. Why is it the woman is not considered queer when she wears men’s clothing? Men have become more effeminate and women have become more masculine, in recent history.

  • Ingo Breuer

    I really agree with this article. I prefer classic jeans that are made in the USA. I really go with Texas Jeans because they are made in North Carolina and they cost about $30 only. They last long too. Because I am an old-time Christian who hasn’t gone modern I thought about wearing more overalls. They were standard in a time back when America was still a Christian nation. Round-House would be the Made in the USA option.

  • Lucy Drury

    I believe there is also an element of being able to buy and clothe yourself in an identity that doesn’t exist or doesn’t belong to you. Worn or tattered clothing would imply honest hard work and toil. People wearing these fashions are frauds in that sense. It’s also a distortion on the true and good value of material things.

  • ironboots

    Good comments John, Clothing exists to protect and adorn the body and modesty of the person, besides the clothing you mentioned manner of speech, posture, gesture and general presentation. Today, people are like zombies. They are brain dead because they are too lazy to think or they do not know what is morally correct. To pay off the wall prices for ridiculous apparel, or they cow tow down to fashions due to trend. They lack courage. Excellent article

  • RCQ157@yahoo.com

    I am not a great sewer at all mine don’t look really good but thanks to liquid glue I can paste the seems together and that takes care of the sewing part and it looks good and nobody will know that you flunked at sewing. Anyway folks I mostly wear hand me downs as I am not able to afford expensive clothes nor do I care about expensive clothes. I am happy with what I have and I don’t cater to who is wearing the latest fashion or to even keep up with the joneses or the rich crowd as I care less what they are doing or who they are lying to or molesting each other or molesting children as they will be judged one day by God and they will have to answer to God and what he does with them that is entirely up to him. Be thankful of what you have also try to help others who are less fortunate than the average person and don’t judge others by the color of their skin as God made us one people but others try to divide us because we don’t believe in their lies and corruption, yes I am referring to you Muslims, terroriists and all you haters of religion and all you wet backs or should I say Mexicans. I say it like it is and tell the truth instead of spreading lies or your lies, if you need others to spread your lies try the liar Barack Obama, Hillary Clinton and the democratic party made up of KKK members that calls themselves democrats who are all pedophiles rapists queers lesbians and the scum of the earth.

  • Aint So

    Something you fail to mention John is that, at least on the face of it, wearing intentionally damaged or ill fitting clothes is a manifestation of the personal childishness we each embody when exiting the birth canal. Childishness is a disposition which anyone who expects to arrive at normal mature adulthood at the proper time in life is supposed to be decisively overcoming in their pre teen years, not embracing it. Unaddressed childishness extending to a great extent even into ones retirement years is the primary reason why a preponderance of Americans never really “grow up” and why self esteem (selfishness) is valued as a virtue over self respect (selflessness)

    • robert

      A taste of sanity for a change……how refreshing.
      It’s not that these people have lost their modesty, so much as they have lost the very sense of modesty. They have no true conception of modesty, nor do they accurately have a real conception of God. For one to err in some way, in ignorance, is one thing, but to err willingly or in defiance/rebellion borders on the satanic. I Sam. 15:23…”For rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness is as iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from being king.”

      • Aint So

        How interesting you should arrive at this most salient of convictions when entire families are speeding toward their own destruction who have not. Most Christian parents I know are under the foolish impression that their children who attend public schools are frequently lied to and misled by their instructors. They conclude that the remedy for this dilemma is to be ever vigilant in teaching their children the truth at home. The problem is that their children are not merely deceived and lied to by their “educators”, they are rendered cognitively corrupt from the earliest age so they develop no actual capacity as adults to even recognize actual truth to any degree and are therefore rendered unable to identify genuine truth let alone act upon it. This in turn enables the ridiculous and unnatural fashions, actions, and behaviors which are elevated to the status of being the product of virtue rather than of corruption that they really are. The enabling of this corruption is vigorously pursued by the Enemy, his adherents, and concubines above all else, and especially in the case of vulnerable children because once corrupt they are so easily dominated and coerced in facilitating the embrace of their own destruction. This is a process which is made much easier and effective if you have the full cooperation and assistance of the undefended victims as well as their clueless parents who were also the products of those same schools. These fashions are merely a symptom of a much deeper self embraced corruption which if not recognized and rejected can easily sicken and kill those who have allowed themselves vulnerability to it instead of to God.

  • wdsdjoan

    If you think “distressed” jeans are immodest, what do you think of a full-figured woman wearing a tube-top, above-the-knee dress at Mass? I actually saw this last Sunday. And it wasn’t the first time I saw women inappropriately dressed at my parish. I don’t know if I can voice my opinion to anyone there when I’ve seen my pastor’s new secretary in tight clothes and stilleto heels walking with him. I get the feeling that this behavior is o.k. because we need to be inclusive of a certain culture. They might leave the Catholic Church.

  • Daniel Rory Lally

    Something seem to motivate teenage girls and young women to dress like this. The majority do not dress this way, but many do. This is currently not as common among the male population. Sometimes I wonder if this is a reaction to the use of overdone fashion in the other extreme.

  • Nathan Matthew

    I wear jeans to church every week. Always have and will continue to do so. The only time i play dress up and stare at myself in the mirror too long is for special occasions where people want to take pictures at weddings etc etc. I see people all the time at church that are fixated on how they look. I agree that there is ALOT of immodesty in public and especially at mass but come on people. Give it a rest. Im on the opposite end when it comes to people judging on clothes at mass. Except when it comes to certain fashions like this article states. According to people on here if you’re not in dress pants and a collared shirt God will be offended hahaha I can just see the pharisees of the day feeling the same way as many of you.

  • Annel Rodriguez

    I have read lots of comments regarding this article and its sad to see how many “Catholic Christians” have a buffet mind about what they choose to agree or disagree regarding God’s teachings thru His church about many cultural disorders and modesty is 1 of them. As Christians we do not belong to this world or fashions Jesus said we “live in this world but do not belong in it” we can not “serve God and Mammon” Gods words not mine. If you call yourself a “Catholic Christian” regardless of how much you attend Mass or how involved you are in your parish but freely choose to reject Catholic moral teaching, or any other teaching you’re in trouble! I’m not judging your soul, I’m just saying you are in trouble. Jesus said to the apostles”whoever rejects you, rejects me” Jesus speaks through His church and whoever chooses to follow the culture, fashions, trends ideologies contrary to church teachings is plainly rejecting Christ and saying: God is wrong and I’m right! We would all agree that being a Catholic Christian is NOT easy but we MUST choose we got free will one of Gods gifts to humanity. I will keep in my prayers ALL those who have freely chosen to serve Mammon and not God by falling for what the culture dictates is “cute, right, comfortable, fair etc…” Christianity isn’t supposed to be comfortable or cute. Its a free choice and way of life, and if one has left the church because of rejection of teachings or human hypocrisy and sinfulness, remember there is hypocrisy and sinfulness in ALL other protestant denominations outside the Catholic church, however, they DO NOT possess the bread of life(Eucharist) and when Jesus Christ said ” unless you eat the flesh of man and drink His blood you DO NOT have life in you” He meant it literally! The Catholic church is ark of Peter where life for the journey to heaven is truly present. With charity and all my love may God bless all of you, keep you and grant you His supernatural peace!

    • regina cates

      Wait. We are still talking about…jeans with a rip in the knee, right?

  • Terrence Snyder

    I agree that intentionally ripped, torn, sliced, cut, clothing is not legitimate clothing and is therefore not modest clothing. Glad that you said something about it. God bless you.

  • albdisqus

    I have trouble thinking anything can be more immodest than yoga pants and everyone is wearing them. They leave very little to the imagination.

  • Paula Proulx

    I think it is just a fashion trend and will disappear when the newer styles come in. What you have to remember is that the fashion industry is just that – an industry. Fashions will change because if the same clothes remain in style, the industry will suffer money-wise. I don’t really see a problem with ripped jeans. It’s the short shorts and tank tops that are really immodest. My daughter has many tattoos ( she’s 33 ) and weird piercings. I have learned to accept her the way she is, and love her without criticism. Her daughter ( 14 ) has a nose piercing. Not into tattoos. Does wear immodest fashions at times, but I always mention it, like ” well, it’s really lovely, but I think the top is too low cut for you.) She just laughs at me and says she is no longer a Christian. Too much criticism will just drive them away – so what good is that to me.
    BTW, I am from the sixties, and wore very short miniskirts, and went to church in them. Never even occurred to me that they were immodest, just the fashion. And because we were pretty poor ( 9 kids ), my devoutly Catholic mother sewed them for me, so we could look in style. She was the most wonderful mother in the world!

  • Helena Horwath

    Something not mentioned above in the article is that torn clothing was a sign of mourning.

  • If ripped jeans or slit skirts don’t expose more skin than ordinary shorts or shorter skirts expose, I don’t see it as immodest…just silly. Are kids still doing that? The style is sooo old. And wearing things *just* because older people hated them was such a baby-boomer thing. Nevertheless…see below…

  • proudmomoffive

    Extremely disturbing is the pajama trend. I see more and more everyday, people, walking out the street of my neighborhood, in Walmart, in the Post Office, etc., simply wearing their pajamas, any hour of the day. How Terrible!! To think that it is ok to step out of your house wearing your pajamas! What a corruption of customs. when I see somebody wearing their pajamas like nothing, out of the privacy of their homes, I turn my eyes else where in disgust. What is next in this trend of degradation?

  • jeremy langlois

    some clothing that are not clothing’s are leggings, short shorts, shirts that are sexy, bikinis… you get the idea what I mean. This world is hard to find modest clothing.

  • Rose Charles

    I agree with the coincept that we conform to all the negatives proposed by society. We allow society to hijack our common sense

  • Nina Young

    I want offer to you my favourite space http://inkprofy.com/church-… where I always find answers for all my style questions.

  • sistermaryg

    I have only heard two brave people in my life say that pants on women is immodest. The first time I heard it I didn’t understand why anyone would think that. The second time I heard it was from a Vatican official quoted in “Dressing with Dignity”. Then I read “For Girls Only” (by Shaunti Feldhahn and Lisa A. Rice) and I was convinced of the truth of it. All you girls out there, there is no way you can know why pants on women is immodest, but all the men out there, you know it very well. Say something.